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  1. #1
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    Default ST185 engine tranny with front lsd?

    could someone who knows more than me on this chassis (probably most of you)

    Tell me if this shows a front LSD? If so, which unit would this be.
    "ceramic power"? which ST185s had this?

    JDM-CELICA-ST185-ALL-TRAC-3SGTE-TURBO-ENGINE-5-SPEED-AWD-LSD-TRANSMISSION-ECU
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  2. #2
    Senior Member DudeMan will become famous soon enough DudeMan's Avatar

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    There is no front LSD, seller is full of it.

    Ceramic power is a JDM thing, the compressor wheel is ceramic and spools a bit faster. Not as reliable at higher boost though.

    That engine looks like it was hacked out in 10 minutes..
    -Chase

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    Thank you.

    which JDM engines got the ceramic turbo? I know my RC engine doesn't have it.
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  4. #4

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    Yes, the ST185 RC engine has the ceramic turbo. I have an official RC and i can confirm with that link also...
    http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/3sgte%20table.htm
    Quote Originally Posted by temperacerguy View Post
    Thank you.

    which JDM engines got the ceramic turbo? I know my RC engine doesn't have it.

  5. #5

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    AFAIK all JDM gen II 3sgtes got the ceramic turbo except the homologation engines.
    I've never actually looked at either of my RC engines to check though.
    If I remember I'll take a look at them when I'm at the garage next.

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  6. #6
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    It is an LSD trans... center diff = torsen.

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  7. #7

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    this.
    - Mario
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    Questions?

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  8. #8
    Senior Member DudeMan will become famous soon enough DudeMan's Avatar

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    Center diff is viscous coupling, rear is torsen.
    -Chase

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  9. #9

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    Viscous coupling "lock" type for center.
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  10. #10
    I'll be the little spoon KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey has a reputation beyond repute KoreanJoey's Avatar
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    Doh, my bad.

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    Originally Posted by MCcelica
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  11. #11
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    Either way, yes it does have an LSD.

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    Originally Posted by MCcelica
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  12. #12

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    LSD is only an option for rear diff. No front LSD exists unless cusco and that's £££££££ and will only sell I batches now. A front centre lsd is supposidly in development by someone else but no word on price yet...

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  13. #13
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by belanger33 View Post
    Yes, the ST185 RC engine has the ceramic turbo. I have an official RC and i can confirm with that link also...
    http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/3sgte%20table.htm
    Wrong...

    The RC/CS models had an inconel compressor wheel and the comp wheel is a few mm larger actually. I used to have one and I compared them side by side... The RC/CS turbos had a 41mm comp wheel, the USDM had a 38mm comp wheel, and the ct20b has a 46mm wheel. The JDM "ceramics power" branded intake manifold engines were the only ones to see ceramic turbines. The CT20b in the gen 3 motors is also ceramic, but the turbine wheel in the WRC st205 was inconel because of homologation rules.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrdb View Post
    LSD is only an option for rear diff. No front LSD exists unless cusco and that's £££££££ and will only sell I batches now. A front centre lsd is supposidly in development by someone else but no word on price yet...

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    The only front LSDs I know of for this car are TRD, TTA. The TTA unit may be the same as the TRD unit, but I did not want to spend 5,000usd to find out.
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  15. #15
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    Um.... what's "TTA"?
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  16. #16

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    Toyota team australia. They developed an active center lsd for our gearboxes as well. The only issue is they cost around 12000usd just for the parts.
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  17. #17

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    That's a getrag box needs tte drive shafts hubs and struts also also expensive and rare...

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  18. #18

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    How much misinformation can we fit into one thread?
    It's not a Getrag box, it's a basic E150F/E151F with an open front and open center [YES] diff.
    Same shit that came on every other normal ST185.

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeMan View Post
    Center diff is viscous coupling, rear is torsen.
    Center diff is an OPEN diff. Center and front diff are in the same housing in the transmission. There is a viscous coupling in the transfer case that helps the center diff act like an LSD, but the center diff is actually open. Just for the record.

    Quote Originally Posted by l0ch0w View Post
    Wrong...

    The RC/CS models had an inconel compressor wheel and the comp wheel is a few mm larger actually. I used to have one and I compared them side by side... The RC/CS turbos had a 41mm comp wheel, the USDM had a 38mm comp wheel, and the ct20b has a 46mm wheel. The JDM "ceramics power" branded intake manifold engines were the only ones to see ceramic turbines. The CT20b in the gen 3 motors is also ceramic, but the turbine wheel in the WRC st205 was inconel because of homologation rules.
    I'll second this. I was pretty sure it was true anyways [haven't checked my RC turbos yet].
    Ceramic turbines shatter under high[er] boost so Toyota didn't run them on thier race cars, so they couldn't run them on the homologation cars either...

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  19. #19

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    Tte use getrag box in all none production class st185 rally cars.

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  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrdb View Post
    That's a getrag box needs tte drive shafts hubs and struts also also expensive and rare...

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    Nope. I spoke to them years ago and this was a lsd system made for the st205 oem gearbox they used in their awd converted rally corolla. You may be thinking of TTE, but they used and X-Trac in their gtfours, which required special hubs and axles. I spoke to the guy in Europe that has the old stock of TTE parts. He had some x-tracs for sale, but the cost was quite high and he recommended buying two. One to fix while using the other.
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  21. #21

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    Sorry brain fart meant x trac not getrac... And yes tte

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  22. #22

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    Yes, but the engine/trans in that link are not getrac or x trac.
    It's a factory production engine/trans out of an ST185.

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  23. #23

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    Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm new to this....one needs a PhD to fully understand the "E" series boxes fitted to FWD and AWD Celica's, MR2 turbo, RAV4, Camry/Solara V6, ST206 Curren, ST216 Caldina etc

    There's major confusion out there when it comes to the Celica AWD gearbox which comes about as the Rally teams had LSD diffs and also LSD diffs are available for these boxes.

    The rally team (TTE) used sequential custom made X-Trac gearboxes which you can still buy IF you have money to burn and a holiday house in Switzerland.
    The group N Rally cars (Production class) were restricted to stock gearboxes but the teams did have special LSD's made - cost was $5000+ ea
    The Quaife, TRD, Kaaz aftermarket LSD units are intended to go into the V6 FWD boxes only - Camry, Solara V6 etc and will not work in the AWD box.
    Nor will they work in MR2 turbo box without changing to FWD driveshafts as the OEM RWD LSD uses much bigger driveshaft inners.

    The FWD Touring cars, Carina, Camry etc used sequential 6 speed boxes made by Quaife, Hewland and X-Trac - again you could order one when holidaying in your Swiss home.


    This ST182 is fitted with an ex Touring car motor (note the reversed head) with FWD sequential box, it's impressive to watch with "only" 290hp on tap -

    All these FWD sequential boxes (and the WRC AWD) are unsuitable for road use in that they use straight cut gears and the noise is horrendous, think reverse in all gears

    Whats esp confusing to noobs is that the "C"- (A engines), "S" - (S engines), and "E" - (S turbo engines, V6's & RAV 4X4) gearboxes look similar and are easily confused and take some familiarization.
    There are also major differences inside the boxes and not all models are the same, ie I believe the RAV4 version has much thinner gears

    Here you can see the two shafts going to the transfer box, should be easy to eliminate one and convert it to FWD? - WRONG, the inner feeds power to the RHS front wheel, the outer feeds power to the viscous coupling and uses the drag of the coupling to engage the open front diff.


    The AWD LSD is complex in that it is actually TWO LSD's in order to engage the front wheels, there are currently NO aftermarket LSD's available to do this.
    Some have tried welding up/locking the viscous coupling and the result is aways the same - broken collars or worse - the viscous coupling itself explodes or burns up


    The TTE X-Trac gearbox - The 1st Rally car to be fitted with a 6 speed sequential gearbox - uses a hydralic (hydralock) coupling system.
    It features a front LSD diff which is said to have eliminated power-on understeer completely and made the cars tail-happy

    These were also made to fit the FWD Touring cars

    The Quaife Touring car FWD sequential 6 speed gearbox - different bellhousings meant it was widely used


    The Hewland Touring car FWD sequential 6 speed gearbox - bellhousings can be made to fit any FWD


    An early (JDM only?) F1 ST165 box, it used a pneumatic locking centre diff and was quickly withdrawn in favour of the F2 viscous type
    Still trying to get info on these and they are extinct, I'll be shocked to come across another one


    Some of the various shafts, note the thick MR2 LSD inners


    So how do I know if mine's an LSD? - simple, can you see thru it?
    LSD


    non-LSD


    Can a AWD or MR2 box be used in FWD mode? - yes
    Here's my E153 F2 converted to FWD with an MR2 LSD Diff & cover plate, Camry, Solara etc does not have LSD but looks identical.


    There is talk some ST206 Currens with Beams motors are also LSD but as yet no photgraphic proof has been found
    Last edited by schnee; 03-10-2012 at 12:44 PM.

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  24. #24
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco temperacerguy is just really nice temperacerguy is just really nice temperacerguy is just really nice temperacerguy is just really nice

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    You are incorrect about the MR2 halfshafts and aftermarket LSDs. but that's a whole other discussion.
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  25. #25

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    Thanks for that, I checked a couple of build threads and you are correct
    No wonder I'm strugging to find MR2-T shafts

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