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  1. #1

    Default Throttle Body Info

    If you have any measured data please post it. I will continue to combine this info into the first post as it is added. --Jeff

    4AFE TB: 1.965" or 49.911mm (call it 50mm)
    5SFE TB: 1.965" or 49.911mm (call it 50mm)
    22RE TB: 2.165" or 54.991mm (call it 55mm)

    4AFE area: 3.04in2 or 1963mm2
    5SFE area: 3.04in2 or 1963mm2
    22RE area: 3.68in2 or 2375mm2

    The early 4AFE and the 5SFE also share the same throttle position sensor circuit. They read three basic positions.

    Closed loop
    It reads as an open in the circuit from just above idle to about 80% throttle. At this time the computer is running in closed loop mode, controling fuel based on base maps and its sensors. All three pins of the sensors connector read and open. (no continuity between any pins)

    Idle open loop
    Running off of maps and sometimes sensors. The bottom and the middle pin should read closed (continuity)

    Open loop
    At about 80% and above, the sensor closes the top and the middle pin, causing the engine to go into open loop and basicly dump fuel to keep from detonating.

    Yes the 4a is the same size and bold pattern as the 5s. Go figure
    Jeff


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  2. #2

    Default

    edit:

    Toyota

    55mm - 4age stock TB
    60mm - supra 7mgte
    60mm - 3rd gen 3sge
    75mm - 2jzge

    Other

    60mm - 3000gt vr4 and 3rd gen eclipse
    60mm - 4g63 (NA and turbo)
    62mm - integra type R and Civic Type R
    90mm - infiniti Q45
    2005 C200 Kompressor sport
    K&N Filter, HKS 2.5" throttle pipe, Apexi WS2 Muffler, DIY Voltage Stabilizer, Intrax lowering springs, H&R rear 19mm sway bar, EBC redstuff pads, EBC 13" front rotors, Stop Tech front brake lines, VDO Boost gauge @ 7psi, Greddy Iridium Plugs, Sprintbooster
    On the way:HKS FCD's (12psi), Remus testpipe (2ndary cat), vortech 2:1 FMU

    my blog:
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  3. #3

    Default

    2nd gen 3sgte: 55mm
    area: 2375.829mm2
    bar for butterfly 10mm
    area: 550mm2
    total area: 1825.829
    Pretty sure the 2nd gen 3sge is the same

  4. #4
    n00b Clint is on a distinguished road

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    Default

    Yep Gen 2 3SGE and 3SGTE are both 55mm.

    1GGTE is 60mm

    3TGTE is 50mm

  5. #5
    Junior Member diabolical1 is on a distinguished road

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    Default

    EDIT: i was asking a question about the 3SGTE throttle bodies and forgot that we're talking about N/A engines.

    for the record, i was trying to confirm whether the 1991-92 USDM 3SGTE throttle bodies are smaller than the 1993-95 throttle bodies.
    Last edited by diabolical1; 08-22-2005 at 06:39 AM.

  6. #6

    Default

    "2nd gen 3sgte: 55mm " << is this USDM ? if so then this should be a simple find/swap for the 5sfe ?

    -nuke
    2005 C200 Kompressor sport
    K&N Filter, HKS 2.5" throttle pipe, Apexi WS2 Muffler, DIY Voltage Stabilizer, Intrax lowering springs, H&R rear 19mm sway bar, EBC redstuff pads, EBC 13" front rotors, Stop Tech front brake lines, VDO Boost gauge @ 7psi, Greddy Iridium Plugs, Sprintbooster
    On the way:HKS FCD's (12psi), Remus testpipe (2ndary cat), vortech 2:1 FMU

    my blog:
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  7. #7

    Default

    How would puttin a larger throttle body on a 5sfe help it out. I'm just tryin to understand the gains you would recieve from doing this.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by partyball
    How would puttin a larger throttle body on a 5sfe help it out. I'm just tryin to understand the gains you would recieve from doing this.
    A larger throttle body should reduce the restriction in the intake stream.

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    -Dave
    "Mechanical engineers do it with less energy and greater efficiency."

  9. #9

    Default

    So what kind of horsepower increase would this produce.

  10. #10

    Default

    I know the 4age throttlebody will flow more air than the 3sgte throttlebody, it has a spaller diameter shaft. Has anyone ever test fit a 4age tb onto the 5sfe intake?
    Just wondering as I am having some bad TB issues on my 5sfe MR2 and I happen to have a boatload of 4age tb's.
    Bill Strong
    Owner
    Racing Strong Motorsports
    The MR2 Owners Club


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  11. #11

    Default

    im gonna run an 82 supra afm with a 7mge tb or a 5m, only diff is ones got a longer neck on it

    the 82 afm are the only ones that will work on the 85 celica with tccs

    late 85 22re -92 has tccs

    it changed again in late 92

    edit u need a a/f guage to tune the set up right because u gotta adjust the lil wheel in the afm
    94 camry base 5speed, oil pump exploded
    87 yota truck, it runs, it's in beater phase but it's been mobile.
    85 celica gt-s @311k...22RTE will 2016 be the year Joe fixes the 3rd gen
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    "U Shoulda bought a 3rd gen"

  12. #12

    Default

    in N/A applications, a larger TB typically results in sharper throttle response.

    On Turbo engines, with accompanying mods, a larger throttle body elimates a potential bottleneck in the intake system, assuming the intake manifold, piping, is not the restrictor.
    '87 3S-GE(T) put into a 1990 GTS
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    GATOR ALUMNI!! 2007 :ohyeah:

    Celica Webpage Click
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  13. #13

    Default

    I am not to experenced in the subject but I do know that if you have a 92 gt with a 5s-fe and you go to the junkyard to get a throttle body and you find one from a 91 st that the throttle body will fit but the TPS (throttle Postion sensor) will not it is three prong and the connection the 4 prong and this little bit of information would of help me alot about 2 days ago cause now my baby is just sitting and will not move until i get the damn tps set right. anyone in hampton roads, virginia that is feeling generous and want to trade doing some work I am really good with electrical stuff.

  14. #14

    Default

    V6 Camry/Solara/Avalon 1MZ-FE
    TB Bore= 60mm
    Interesting note is that the whole throttle body is identical to the 5sfe including flange/bolt pattern, tps, etc. except for the cable attatchment which faces the opposite direction.
    (Thanks to 88GT2GTS for measurement info)

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  15. #15

    Default

    just to confirm the rev2 3S-GE is 55mm.

    I also have a beams red top one in the garage, i'll measure it up for you guys when I'm next in there and remember! its big, and too big for what I want- The intake plenum is smaller than the beams throttle body.

  16. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by grayscale
    V6 Camry/Solara/Avalon 1MZ-FE
    TB Bore= 60mm
    Interesting note is that the whole throttle body is identical to the 5sfe including flange/bolt pattern, tps, etc. except for the cable attatchment which faces the opposite direction.
    (Thanks to 88GT2GTS for measurement info)
    and the 5S-FE has the same throttlebody as the 4AFE meaning it should be an easy swap? this 1MZ-FE engine, is this a relative OLD engine or one of the new motors?

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  17. #17

    Default

    i've got a 90 gts what would be a good tb upgrade for my car or would i be better off going with a tb spacer?

  18. #18

    Default

    beams redtop is 67mm.

  19. #19

    Default

    i have 4a-fe and on my tb i am missing the idle adjustment screw (i think thats what it is) and my car idles around 1,200 rpm's in park and neutral. its
    nice to know that i can look at more applications then just another 4a-fe. if anybody knows of a better tb then a stock tb please let me know.

  20. #20

    Default

    i just decided to go to a salvage yard and buy a tb and just took the screw out.so never mind about that last post.

  21. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by celica1990gts
    i've got a 90 gts what would be a good tb upgrade for my car or would i be better off going with a tb spacer?
    Yes i am also wondering myself, im looking to upgrade for roadcourse, but idk if i should spend the 1100 dollars or if a spacer will give me a decent push in power.

    Now on second hand, I am headed to the metal yard to conjur up my own cold air intake system for the 5th gen 2.2l non turbo. but idk if i should put it in the bumper/DS fender or mold a tunnel ram to it and put it in the center section of my bumper. Some of your thoughts might help out with this problem.

  22. #22

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by grayscale
    V6 Camry/Solara/Avalon 1MZ-FE
    TB Bore= 60mm
    Interesting note is that the whole throttle body is identical to the 5sfe including flange/bolt pattern, tps, etc. except for the cable attatchment which faces the opposite direction.
    (Thanks to 88GT2GTS for measurement info)
    So does this mean that this would be a feasable throttle body swap for a 5SFE? Does anybody have pictures of the two of them side by side or at least pictures to compare?

    What all would be required in order to make the 1MZ throttle body work on the 5S? I don't know anything about swapping throttle bodies.
    David Walker
    ------------------

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  23. #23

    Default

    if you can turn a wrench, you can swap TB's

  24. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by slow_yota
    if you can turn a wrench, you can swap TB's
    I am not to worried about the mechanical side, I am wondering about the electrical / operational side.

    I am just wondering the compatibility for the throttle body actually working, I read something above about some are 3 point and another was 4 point.
    David Walker
    ------------------

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  25. #25

    Default

    This is the best comparison pic so far that I have of the 1mz tb in question as I have yet to find one to buy at a reasonable price.

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