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  1. #1
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco angryyoungnpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Default *sigh* What to do..

    So, I have a 1st gen 3sgte that came with my car. I'm being a baby and don't know if I really want to keep this engine as there isn't much of an aftermarket for them. I'm tryign to figure out if I should just keep this engine and do what I can with it, or buy a 2nd gen engine... and with that, how much would it cost? A used one would be fine. I don't really know what all I'd need.

    I could just buy the 2nd gen and build it up. The 1st gen is just bothering me, because they ain't shit for this engine.

    Goals... to keep building and building with the budget I have.
    1990 White GTS/W swap ///// 1992 RED GT

  2. #2
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD's Avatar
    ChrisD has been to an official Ogopogo Meet! ChrisD has donated to the forums! ChrisD helped get Luni's MR2 back on the road! ChrisD helped bring Chaos back to the Dragon ChrisD helped KM replace his 5-year-old clutch.

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    Default

    Tell me, exactly why don't you like the ST165 engine?
    1988 ST165 2.2L @ 370awhp
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    1994 ST205 WRC
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  3. #3
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco angryyoungnpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Default

    I actually don't know yet. I still haven't started nor put the damn thing back in the car.
    I just like the aftermarket of st185.. unless I can be persuaded otherwise. I'd like to upgrade turbos and everything, but would rather not have to rely on all custom work. It'd be great to just keep this engine, but.. yeah.. I don't know. As far as I can see on ATSracing, the turbo upgrades are all for st185, unless they can fit on 165's. I've already had one problem of finding a manifold that would fit on the 165, ended up not aligning correctly, so I decided to go with the stock. *Shakes fist*
    1990 White GTS/W swap ///// 1992 RED GT

  4. #4
    Blowing Stereotypes, ya heard? Snafu Vanilla Ice gets more respect.. Snafu's Avatar
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    Default

    To be honesty, you picked a crappy manifold. It would have done that no matter what the engine.

    I'm pretty sure you can bolt on most of the 2nd gen mods on the 1st gen. Manifolds/turbos bolt up, no?
    1988 CRX DX - Drag Car
    Vitara/TT rod Z6 - Sinktrap Manifold - GM9 turbo

    www.mydragcar.com/snafu

  5. #5

    Default

    Taken from Toyota's Techinfo site comparinf the 90 3sgte to the 89 3sgte (USDM):

    
    3S–GTE ENGINE

    Based on the previous 3S–GTE engine, the new model has higher performance and response resulting from less

    exhaust interference, a twin–entry turbocharger that enhances low–speed performance and acceleration, an

    increase in valve list and compression ratio, and an air–to–air intercooler.


    2007 Mazda RX-8 GT
    1992 Toyota Celica All-trac Turbo

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  6. #6

    Default

    Nothing too major.
    2007 Mazda RX-8 GT
    1992 Toyota Celica All-trac Turbo

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  7. #7

    Default

    Here is the whole thing for engines if anyone is curious:

    ENGINE
    ENGINE LINE–UP
    The engine line–up for the New Celica includes three types of in–line, four–cylinder, gasoline engines consisting of the

    3S–GTE (turbocharged, 2.0–liter, 16–valve DOHC), 5S–FE (2.2–liter, 16–valve DOHC) and 4A–FE (1.6–liter, 16–valve

    DOHC).

    Displace–

    ment

    Engine

    Type

    Max. Output

    (SAE–NET)

    Max. Torque

    (SAE–NET)

    Features

    2.0 L 3S–GTE 200 HP @ 6000 rpm 200 ft
    .lbs @ 3200 rpm

    The Celica image leader and most

    powerful engine combine the DOHC

    and turbocharger features

    2.2 L 5S–FE 130 HP @ 5400 rpm 140 ft
    .lbs @ 4400 rpm

    Revised on the basis of the previous

    3S–FE, it has a larger piston

    displacement and more power

    1.6 L 4A–FE 103 HP @ 6000 rpm

    (102 HP @ 5800 rpm)

    102 ft
    .lbs @ 3200 rpm

    (101 ft
    .lbs @ 4800 rpm)

    A compact DOHC engine that offers

    economy and good driving

    characteristics

    ( ): For California Specification Vehicle

    
    3S–GTE ENGINE

    Based on the previous 3S–GTE engine, the new model has higher performance and response resulting from less

    exhaust interference, a twin–entry turbocharger that enhances low–speed performance and acceleration, an

    increase in valve list and compression ratio, and an air–to–air intercooler.

    
    5S–FE ENGINE

    This engine is based on the previous 3S–FE engine and has a larger piston displacement (increased from 2.0 to

    2.2 liters).

    The L type EFI of the 3S–FE engine was replaced with the D type having less intake air resistance. In addition,

    an increased compression ratio (changed from 9.3 to 9.5) and new valve timing also contribute to increased power

    output and improved drivability in normal ranges.

    
    4A–FE ENGINE

    This is a compact DOHC engine, already used in the Corolla All–Trac Station Wagon, having the scissors gear

    mechanism feature and D type EFI.

    2007 Mazda RX-8 GT
    1992 Toyota Celica All-trac Turbo

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  8. #8

    Default

    table posted bad. I can attach pdf upon request.
    2007 Mazda RX-8 GT
    1992 Toyota Celica All-trac Turbo

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  9. #9
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco angryyoungnpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Default

    Hm.. so it's pretty much still the same engine, just a few differences? hm.. Can anybody confirm this? ChrisD... didn't you change to an st185.? Why did you do this?
    1990 White GTS/W swap ///// 1992 RED GT

  10. #10
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD has much to be proud of ChrisD's Avatar
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    Default

    Almost all turbo upgrades for the ST185 will work on the ST165. I would recommend getting a ST185 / MR2 manifold though, because their cast is a much better design.

    Fuel rail is a better top feed design.

    Intercooler isn't as good, thats one thing to change.

    Compression ratio is lower...safer for boost theoretically...

    Intake manifold upgrades are compatible.

    Cams, valves, valve springs are not. Have to find alternate upgrades for this if thats the route you want to go.

    Electronics are very similar. Any aftermarket ECU's can be made to fit the 165 systems with a little extra work.

    There are some things I'd remove from the equation though, like the FPR VSV.

    With proper precaution, you can build a monster out of either engine.

    That said, I'm very happy with my ST185 engine in my ST165.
    1988 ST165 2.2L @ 370awhp
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  11. #11
    Ultimo Miembro Fantástico Gigantesco angryyoungnpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Default

    hah.. so.. I have a 2nd gen ecu/harness.. Is that a bad thing? I do believe it's a 2nd gen harness. I'm doing a front mount, so that's not a problem. What's the FPR VSV.. fuel pressure regulator.. something. I guess I'll figure out more and more as time goes on and mods are done. For now I just want to get it put together and running.
    1990 White GTS/W swap ///// 1992 RED GT

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