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View Full Version : Finding new rear suspension parts ('91 ST184 GT)



toplessFC3Sman
04-20-2014, 05:01 PM
Hello,

I'm working on the rear suspension of my fiance's 91 GT trying to replace all the bushings in the lower suspension arms, and unfortunately am dealing with a lot of rust issues on the bolts holding it all together. Fortunately, none of the rust I've found is structural, but nonetheless it makes disassembly very difficult. I've already had to cut the heads off of the very long bolts that run through the outside ends of the two suspension arms, and now cannot get the toe adjusting cam to come out of the inner end of the rear arm.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-jjF7rI6e8mk/U1Pt_KfCxKI/AAAAAAAACZQ/6btL1unwk_o/w506-h552-no/Rear+Suspension.jpg

This is the toe-adjusting cam, in all it's rusted-together glory:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-OQXRlhIG5_k/U1MrJ5BnOeI/AAAAAAAACYw/FgbrPEUN_Rg/w640-h480-no/14+-+1

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-D72BtrpVJ70/U1MrKJ_yMLI/AAAAAAAACZA/1u0X3l2IJ7A/w640-h480-no/14+-+3

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-NPVJrTrUNBw/U1MrKAzOTiI/AAAAAAAACY4/MV69CIbheWg/w640-h480-no/14+-+2

Seems like a simple part, and I didn't have much trouble removing the bolt that runs through it & the adjustment cam/nut on the inside of the box-section. The outer cam that is pressed onto the shaft running through the suspension arm bushing has come off of the shaft, which is firmly rusted into the sleeve in the bushing in the end of the suspension arm.

The plan is to drill this out until the wall of the shaft is thin enough that I can just bend it away to remove the arms from the chassis. Anything you guys would do differently that would make removal easier?

Also, I'll need replacement toe cams & another one of those long bolts - Anyone know where to find them? Does the dealer still stock the alignment cams? None of the auto parts stores seem to.
I've found a replacement for the suspension knuckle, so that's taken care of at least.

Thank you very much!

cuttyman9
04-20-2014, 07:43 PM
techno toy tuning sells new rear control links and trailing arms

their kit removes the rear toe parts altogether.

Galcobar
04-20-2014, 09:20 PM
To start, did you try breaking the toe-adjusting nut loose from the back side? There are plastic covers on the suspension member into which the four lateral arms connect. Inside the hardware is usually in much better condition.

http://www.celicatech.com/forums/showthread.php?34935-HOWTO-Fifth-to-sixth-gen-suspension-member-conversion

As for parts, I'm afraid the only source I've found is the dealership. Best prices are typically through a dealership's online parts counter such as Lithia Toyota, which maintains a sub-forum here and has been good about supporting the Celica community, or 1sttoyotaparts.com.

toplessFC3Sman
04-21-2014, 03:04 AM
Thanks for the responses!

I did remove those covers & get the nuts off & the bolts out - my problem was that the sleeves that are part of the rear cam were rusted into the bushings for the control arms, and I couldn't physically get the sleeves out! Prying just separated the cam from the sleeve!
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-NPVJrTrUNBw/U1MrKAzOTiI/AAAAAAAACY4/MV69CIbheWg/w640-h480-no/14+-+2

Eventually I did get them out, but not without a bit of destructive force.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-CfdpYxPs3oI/U1RfhJsnwZI/AAAAAAAACa0/9fdByc7Yzl4/w640-h480-no/14+-+2

Same goes for those giant bolts that go through both lower control arms and the knuckle - I had to just cut the head off of both of them since they wouldn't budge with any amount of persuasion from a 4-ft breaker bar, torch or impact gun. I can pick up used knuckles for $40 ea, so I just need to worry about replacing that giant bolt.

I checked out the T3 rear control arms, but since this is my fiance's DD, and I already dropped $200 on new bushings for the rear suspension, I'd rather try to find a stock-ish way of adjusting toe & keeping the bushings. I'll call around to a couple dealers to try to find new toe-adjustment cams before moving on to making something else work

METDeath
04-21-2014, 04:43 AM
If you get lucky, you can use the toe adjuster arm from a 6th gen (similar to the T3 parts, only less flashy). There is a write up on the board (can't remember where though) for converting to the newer rear arm.

Edit: Whoops... saw that someone already had the link posted for the conversion.

That said, I'd consider removing that rust if possible and POR15 the affected areas.

Galcobar
04-23-2014, 01:04 AM
The long axle carrier-to-suspension arm bolts come from the dealer with a washer each (90109-A0028). You'll also need 2 x flanged nut (90080-17265) and 2 x plate washers (90201-14017), the eccentric cams and the bolts for the eccentric cams (unfortunately I never bothered to collect the part numbers for those). The toe adjust plate from inside the covered portion of the suspension member should be in reusable condition.

As I suggested, I'd check in with Tracy in the Lithia Toyota sub-forum. He can usually supply part numbers and availability, which lets you order online. If you do get those part numbers, please let me know and I'll add them to my sticky.

Lonestag
04-23-2014, 02:54 AM
Yeah, those bolts large bolts are a BEAR to get off.

I had to buy an 8lb hammer and get out the torch but I DID get them to come out. Why the heck the engineers didn't just seal off that exposed sections thats lets the bolts become rust welded to the assembly, i'm not quite sure.

toplessFC3Sman
05-03-2014, 03:37 AM
Well, after a lot of heat, penetrating fluid, and a mechanical press, I was able to get the passenger's side bolt out of the knuckle. The drivers side wouldn't budge even for the techs & a hefty hydraulic press at the Toyota dealer. A big drill & variety of large drill bits helped me to make the walls of the toe adjustment bushing stuck in the suspension link bushing thin enough that I could deform it and eventually pound it out, so everything got disassembled. I picked up new toe adjustment hardware & those bolts from the Toyota dealer in-town here... $150 total... ouch!

Bushings went very easily with some hole-saws & a harbor freight "sawzall", definitely the easiest time I've had replacing old bushings anyway.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Zf4_htKKNPo/U1vt_djLqnI/AAAAAAAACc4/PZdUdk7IOqw/w640-h480-no/14+-+1
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-dZG8uc2fUg4/U1vhHOgfg8I/AAAAAAAACcU/ryfU-aEK5U0/w640-h480-no/14+-+1

Turns out those $40 knuckles from the junk-yard I mentioned are actually basically the whole suspension corner, so strut, spring, knuckle, wheel bearing, brake, and whatever bits happened to still be bolted to them that got ruthlessly cut off. So I got a bunch of extra stuff of questionable value, but i will need to disassemble everything & deal with that giant bolt again in the "new" piece. Maybe it'll be less stuck? who knows...

cuttyman9
05-03-2014, 07:16 PM
they have a knurl at the one end and they end up rusting into place, try tons and tons of heat then spray water on the bolt and hammer on it


if you need aftermarket rear links T3 sells them for 184 chassis's (technotoytuning.com)

toplessFC3Sman
05-03-2014, 11:31 PM
The bushings in the rear links were the original problem, but the links themselves were fine. I checked out T3's site pretty early on when it was recommended & considered them, as well as using stock Camry or 6th gen rear links to keep the bushings (this is my fiance's DD, not a track car, so some compliance would be nice), but ultimately since I already had the bushings for the stock links, buying new cam sleeves for the rear toe adjustment was the most expedient route.

Now, for the "new-to-me" junkyard suspension...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-JI_6pgjzhMg/U2VuCSLTuDI/AAAAAAAACe4/WR__ZiUZdi0/w640-h480/14+-+3

Looks like it was maybe from an ST or something, considering it was a 4-lug hub, not the 5-lug on the GT. Fortunately, the junkyard suspension came in very handy. That bolt really didn't pose much trouble after adding a bit of heat, hammering a 18mm socket onto the rounded 19mm head, grabbing the 4-ft section of pipe, and standing on the strut while torquing the bolt. That broke it free enough that judicious hammering eventually got it clear of the knuckle. VICTORY!!!
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-3jJ2oAzkUOY/U2VuCch7FYI/AAAAAAAACes/RQgsMr-DAO4/w640-h480-no/14+-+2

Getting the whole corner instead of just the knuckle was actually pretty fortunate, since the strut came in handy for standing on & torquing against, I used the drum to hold the knuckle in as I pounded out the bolt, and the brake hydraulic cylinder that was on it was pretty new, while the one that originally was on the car looked original and was leaking. So after replacing that, those short hard lines that go from the cylinder up to the soft line between the knuckle & body, and the brake shoes, the last corner of the car is freshened up & almost ready to go!
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-C-GF-pDBxrg/U2VuCZCM4YI/AAAAAAAACek/MfyUriRkBeA/w640-h480-no/14+-+1

toplessFC3Sman
05-05-2014, 04:35 PM
Well, it was almost ready to go until it came time to bleed the brakes... It looks like one of the brake circuits is no longer working. The driver's front & passenger's rear brakes bled without a problem, but there was a constant stream of bubbles coming out of the passenger's front & driver's rear brakes, plus a definite notice-able suction-y burbling noise from the master cylinder while trying to bleed them. Seems like the MC is shot, so I need to pick up a new one & replace that, but then it should be done for a while.

Lonestag
05-05-2014, 07:39 PM
Wow, way to stick to it man, i'm glad the end is in sight.

I have learned way to much about rust management with my Celica's

toplessFC3Sman
05-06-2014, 01:43 AM
Yea, I also took a wire brush & sand-paper wheel to the underside & rear suspension mounts to take care of some other rust, plus re-sealing the gas tank a few years ago & replacing all the brake & gas lines running under the car. For the most part, its in good shape for a 23 yr old MI car, and it only has 135k miles, but there's really no way to completely avoid rust. Especially with people sliding into both the fender & quarter panel this winter.

METDeath
05-06-2014, 02:53 AM
If you're replacing the MC, go ahead and get the one for the All-trac, it's a minor upgrade, but well worth it since you're replacing it anyway.

The 4-lug is a 90/91 ST (they were all 5x100 after 92). Thankfully the FWD suspension is mostly the same across the entire line of 5th gens, aside from the 4x100 (90/91 ST) vs 5x100 (everything else).

toplessFC3Sman
05-11-2014, 04:04 AM
The master cylinder is replaced, and after bleeding, all the wheels now actually help to stop the car! For the past two years, I think one of the brake circuits was slowly failing, but now its got much more stopping power. I replaced the MC with another stock part for the GT (15/16ths " bore) instead of the All-trac (1" bore), just because I had already ordered it before getting your note.

Anyway, here she is, with the unfortunately knocked-in front fender from a careless driver in our apartment complex this winter. That will be getting some smoothing & paint in a few weeks.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-x_c2SE1AFCI/U27DyAMWx6I/AAAAAAAACfc/AxyNZcaiJQ0/w640-h480-no/14+-+1
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-B056HDOg_RU/U27DyGr_Q3I/AAAAAAAACfk/phmhtBCUV9I/w640-h480-no/14+-+2

Those are with the summer wheels & tires - they're off of a mid-90's Chrysler Sebring and are the same bolt pattern & similar offset, required new lug nuts andsome thin hub-centering rings. They're 16" wheels that are a bit wider than the stock 14's, opening up a greater tire selection (especially for good performance all-seasons), and look almost OEM. They did need new lug studs from a late 90's dodge caravan, which are the same knurled diameter to press into the hubs as stock, same thread pitch & diameter so the OEM wheels & lugs fit, just about 10mm longer to ensure better thread engagement for the new lug nuts.