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temperacerguy
02-11-2012, 08:27 PM
could someone who knows more than me on this chassis (probably most of you)

Tell me if this shows a front LSD? If so, which unit would this be.
"ceramic power"? which ST185s had this?

JDM-CELICA-ST185-ALL-TRAC-3SGTE-TURBO-ENGINE-5-SPEED-AWD-LSD-TRANSMISSION-ECU (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JDM-CELICA-ST185-ALL-TRAC-3SGTE-TURBO-ENGINE-5-SPEED-AWD-LSD-TRANSMISSION-ECU-/280740220453?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item415d6bce25&vxp=mtr#ht_9223wt_1025)

DudeMan
02-11-2012, 08:49 PM
There is no front LSD, seller is full of it.

Ceramic power is a JDM thing, the compressor wheel is ceramic and spools a bit faster. Not as reliable at higher boost though.

That engine looks like it was hacked out in 10 minutes..

temperacerguy
02-11-2012, 09:29 PM
Thank you.

which JDM engines got the ceramic turbo? I know my RC engine doesn't have it.

belanger33
02-11-2012, 10:48 PM
Yes, the ST185 RC engine has the ceramic turbo. I have an official RC and i can confirm with that link also...
http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/3sgte%20table.htm

Thank you.

which JDM engines got the ceramic turbo? I know my RC engine doesn't have it.

alltracman78
02-14-2012, 06:06 AM
AFAIK all JDM gen II 3sgtes got the ceramic turbo except the homologation engines.
I've never actually looked at either of my RC engines to check though.
If I remember I'll take a look at them when I'm at the garage next.

KoreanJoey
02-15-2012, 06:01 AM
It is an LSD trans... center diff = torsen.

Shadowlife25
02-17-2012, 01:49 AM
this. :)

DudeMan
02-17-2012, 02:43 AM
Center diff is viscous coupling, rear is torsen.

cms-gt4
02-17-2012, 04:28 AM
Viscous coupling "lock" type for center.

KoreanJoey
02-18-2012, 08:43 AM
Doh, my bad.

KoreanJoey
02-18-2012, 08:43 AM
Either way, yes it does have an LSD.

mrdb
02-18-2012, 08:20 PM
LSD is only an option for rear diff. No front LSD exists unless cusco and that's and will only sell I batches now. A front centre lsd is supposidly in development by someone else but no word on price yet...

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l0ch0w
02-19-2012, 12:25 AM
Yes, the ST185 RC engine has the ceramic turbo. I have an official RC and i can confirm with that link also...
http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/3sgte%20table.htm

Wrong...

The RC/CS models had an inconel compressor wheel and the comp wheel is a few mm larger actually. I used to have one and I compared them side by side... The RC/CS turbos had a 41mm comp wheel, the USDM had a 38mm comp wheel, and the ct20b has a 46mm wheel. The JDM "ceramics power" branded intake manifold engines were the only ones to see ceramic turbines. The CT20b in the gen 3 motors is also ceramic, but the turbine wheel in the WRC st205 was inconel because of homologation rules.

cms-gt4
02-20-2012, 01:55 AM
LSD is only an option for rear diff. No front LSD exists unless cusco and that's and will only sell I batches now. A front centre lsd is supposidly in development by someone else but no word on price yet...

Sent from my mind using tapatalk.

The only front LSDs I know of for this car are TRD, TTA. The TTA unit may be the same as the TRD unit, but I did not want to spend 5,000usd to find out.

temperacerguy
02-20-2012, 02:24 AM
Um.... what's "TTA"?

cms-gt4
02-20-2012, 03:55 AM
Toyota team australia. They developed an active center lsd for our gearboxes as well. The only issue is they cost around 12000usd just for the parts.

mrdb
02-20-2012, 08:24 AM
That's a getrag box needs tte drive shafts hubs and struts also also expensive and rare...

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alltracman78
02-20-2012, 03:04 PM
How much misinformation can we fit into one thread?
It's not a Getrag box, it's a basic E150F/E151F with an open front and open center [YES] diff.
Same shit that came on every other normal ST185.


Center diff is viscous coupling, rear is torsen.
Center diff is an OPEN diff. Center and front diff are in the same housing in the transmission. There is a viscous coupling in the transfer case that helps the center diff act like an LSD, but the center diff is actually open. Just for the record.


Wrong...

The RC/CS models had an inconel compressor wheel and the comp wheel is a few mm larger actually. I used to have one and I compared them side by side... The RC/CS turbos had a 41mm comp wheel, the USDM had a 38mm comp wheel, and the ct20b has a 46mm wheel. The JDM "ceramics power" branded intake manifold engines were the only ones to see ceramic turbines. The CT20b in the gen 3 motors is also ceramic, but the turbine wheel in the WRC st205 was inconel because of homologation rules.
I'll second this. I was pretty sure it was true anyways [haven't checked my RC turbos yet].
Ceramic turbines shatter under high[er] boost so Toyota didn't run them on thier race cars, so they couldn't run them on the homologation cars either...

mrdb
02-20-2012, 06:15 PM
Tte use getrag box in all none production class st185 rally cars.

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cms-gt4
02-20-2012, 06:19 PM
That's a getrag box needs tte drive shafts hubs and struts also also expensive and rare...

Sent from my mind using tapatalk.

Nope. I spoke to them years ago and this was a lsd system made for the st205 oem gearbox they used in their awd converted rally corolla. You may be thinking of TTE, but they used and X-Trac in their gtfours, which required special hubs and axles. I spoke to the guy in Europe that has the old stock of TTE parts. He had some x-tracs for sale, but the cost was quite high and he recommended buying two. One to fix while using the other.

mrdb
02-20-2012, 07:26 PM
Sorry brain fart meant x trac not getrac... And yes tte :)

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alltracman78
02-20-2012, 09:52 PM
Yes, but the engine/trans in that link are not getrac or x trac.
It's a factory production engine/trans out of an ST185.

schnee
03-10-2012, 09:54 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm new to this....one needs a PhD to fully understand the "E" series boxes fitted to FWD and AWD Celica's, MR2 turbo, RAV4, Camry/Solara V6, ST206 Curren, ST216 Caldina etc

There's major confusion out there when it comes to the Celica AWD gearbox which comes about as the Rally teams had LSD diffs and also LSD diffs are available for these boxes.

The rally team (TTE) used sequential custom made X-Trac gearboxes which you can still buy IF you have money to burn and a holiday house in Switzerland.
The group N Rally cars (Production class) were restricted to stock gearboxes but the teams did have special LSD's made - cost was $5000+ ea
The Quaife, TRD, Kaaz aftermarket LSD units are intended to go into the V6 FWD boxes only - Camry, Solara V6 etc and will not work in the AWD box.
Nor will they work in MR2 turbo box without changing to FWD driveshafts as the OEM RWD LSD uses much bigger driveshaft inners.

The FWD Touring cars, Carina, Camry etc used sequential 6 speed boxes made by Quaife, Hewland and X-Trac - again you could order one when holidaying in your Swiss home.
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Toyota%20racing/624.jpg

This ST182 is fitted with an ex Touring car motor (note the reversed head) with FWD sequential box, it's impressive to watch with "only" 290hp on tap -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEp4bkZ10GY

All these FWD sequential boxes (and the WRC AWD) are unsuitable for road use in that they use straight cut gears and the noise is horrendous, think reverse in all gears

Whats esp confusing to noobs is that the "C"- (A engines), "S" - (S engines), and "E" - (S turbo engines, V6's & RAV 4X4) gearboxes look similar and are easily confused and take some familiarization.
There are also major differences inside the boxes and not all models are the same, ie I believe the RAV4 version has much thinner gears

Here you can see the two shafts going to the transfer box, should be easy to eliminate one and convert it to FWD? - WRONG, the inner feeds power to the RHS front wheel, the outer feeds power to the viscous coupling and uses the drag of the coupling to engage the open front diff.
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/83045651_full.jpg

The AWD LSD is complex in that it is actually TWO LSD's in order to engage the front wheels, there are currently NO aftermarket LSD's available to do this.
Some have tried welding up/locking the viscous coupling and the result is aways the same - broken collars or worse - the viscous coupling itself explodes or burns up
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/IMG_0002-3.jpg

The TTE X-Trac gearbox - The 1st Rally car to be fitted with a 6 speed sequential gearbox - uses a hydralic (hydralock) coupling system.
It features a front LSD diff which is said to have eliminated power-on understeer completely and made the cars tail-happy
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/X-TRAC165.jpg
These were also made to fit the FWD Touring cars

The Quaife Touring car FWD sequential 6 speed gearbox - different bellhousings meant it was widely used
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/DSCF4552l5icR3sU.jpg

The Hewland Touring car FWD sequential 6 speed gearbox - bellhousings can be made to fit any FWD
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/HewlandA5QZ.jpg

An early (JDM only?) F1 ST165 box, it used a pneumatic locking centre diff and was quickly withdrawn in favour of the F2 viscous type
Still trying to get info on these and they are extinct, I'll be shocked to come across another one
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/BjYjkwQBWkKGrHqYOKjYEsnwunfQBLTW4PI72Q_12.jpg

Some of the various shafts, note the thick MR2 LSD inners
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/axle_comp_s_and_e.jpg

So how do I know if mine's an LSD? - simple, can you see thru it?
LSD
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/205221220_full.jpg

non-LSD
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/192145645_full.jpg

Can a AWD or MR2 box be used in FWD mode? - yes
Here's my E153 F2 converted to FWD with an MR2 LSD Diff & cover plate, Camry, Solara etc does not have LSD but looks identical.
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/Gearbox/205221178_full.jpg

There is talk some ST206 Currens with Beams motors are also LSD but as yet no photgraphic proof has been found

temperacerguy
03-10-2012, 01:45 PM
You are incorrect about the MR2 halfshafts and aftermarket LSDs. but that's a whole other discussion.

schnee
03-10-2012, 09:06 PM
Thanks for that, I checked a couple of build threads and you are correct
No wonder I'm strugging to find MR2-T shafts

cms-gt4
03-12-2012, 06:06 AM
What do you know about that engine in the fwd yellow celica? I had been trying to find more info on this guys setup for a while.

schnee
03-12-2012, 01:07 PM
It's a reverse head ex-Touring car motor rated at 290hp and pics of this car are scarce
http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/engines/HPIM12181.jpg

http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr292/_MrMagoo/Cars/Toyota%20Celica/engines/ToyotaSAfricaimage-0006.jpg

You can try contacting him at:
Armin Buschor
Fitness Wellness Anti-Aging
Postfach 513
FL-9495 Triesen
Switzerland

armin.buschor@gmx.net

RedRkt01
03-12-2012, 03:50 PM
Stig, I loved how you came in here and steamrolled the thread with info. Classic Harper!