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Magnum
12-06-2010, 08:58 AM
What do you guys think of these turbo's. Looks like some well thought out developments.
http://www.full-race.com/articles/borgwarner-efr-turbos.html
A quick look see at the Sierra Sierra Time Attack car (which is fitted with a 2.2L Cosworth motor)
First the EFR8374

220hp at 4000rpm
717hp by 5000rpm.
Similar torque figures.
http://www.full-race.com/store/images/full/borgwarner-efr-8374-turbo-content-12.jpg

And then the EFR9180

http://www.full-race.com/store/images/full/borgwarner-efr-9180-turbo-content-10.jpg

The comparisons are of the 8374 and the 9180. dyno runs were all done on a mustang dyno at 2bar boost, and the cam gears were played with a bit. Unfortunately these were some new cams they were testing out and not the actual cams that are in the car for race day, so tq was dropping off hard and the turbo wasn't spooling as early as they liked.
I thought I'd give one a try so I bought a 7064 with a T4 0.92 I/W Turbine housing.

ChrisD
12-06-2010, 05:31 PM
They are interesting for sure, but haven't seen any on the 3SGTE yet.

Those dynos are tough to compare to since the HP is so high, cams clearly tuned for a high revving race motor, not exactly how you'd set up a DD/weekend warrior car.

I'm sure the smaller turbos would be a decent fit. The 7064 looks like a good choice for >300WHP.

Price is what really throws me, you're in over $1800 for the turbo alone. You can get tried and true Garrett's and Precision turbos for much less.

You fabbing the DP/adaptors/lines yourself? Keep us posted on how this goes, very interested. :)

Magnum
12-06-2010, 07:38 PM
Well look at it this way. If I went with a Garrett GTX3071R which are around $1350-$1400 then add an waste gate, 2 for a twin scroll turbo like mine then that's $250 each. The EFR turbos don't require a BOV so that's another $200. Then you look at the cost of flanges for both and tubing fab. The EFR 7064 is $1806. Fabrication of the turbo manifold,down pipe and inter-cooler pipe work will be easier with this turbo. Also what do you think the new Gamma-Ti turbine wheels is worth over the standard cast turbine wheel. So in the end I feel that the EFR turbo is worth the extra $400- $450 cost just from it's added features and ease of fabrication. I will be building a Twin scroll manifold, lines and down pipe. Some times you have to take a chance with new products. I'm hoping I get good results with this turbo. I could have waited to see how other people fared with this turbo but I have confidence that BorgWarner had put together a good turbo here.

ChrisD
12-06-2010, 10:04 PM
That is true - no BOV or WG so you are shaving a lot of the cost right there. Also, for sure the extra space is especially nice...very hard to fit anything in there, so the more room the better! Also since you'll be building a manifold you wouldn't need an adaptor like many would.

As for the turbine wheels, they say they are better but I guess that is to be seen, since we don't have a lot of data on them yet. Titanium is a good material b/c of it's strength, allows them to use much less material and maintain strength...while lowering weight. All very promising.

Hard for me to talk tho since both mine are still fitted with CT20b's. :P :P

karl
12-08-2010, 02:45 AM
As for the turbine wheels, they say they are better but I guess that is to be seen, since we don't have a lot of data on them yet.

it's also not very new tech. MHI has been running TiAL wheels for years in japan. some of the evoXs even come with them, and they're supposed to spool about 500rpm sooner in a 12cm housing than a standard TD05H in a 10.5cm housing. depending on the choke point of a 10cm housing, and coupled with one of the new kamak or billet 20g wheels with improved aero, it could be possible to see high 400s at the wheels with full boost by just over 3000rpm. i wish i had the cash lying around to make something like that happen. the only really expensive piece would be the TD05HA turbine. it's plug and play with all the rest of existing MHI turbo architecture.

Magnum
12-08-2010, 05:54 AM
I've read that to, but until we see how this turbo performs I'll hope for the best and not make any random guesses on how it will perform. The nice thing about the turbine wheels is it's the same weight as the compressor wheel so it will have a nice balance.