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usp45
04-04-2009, 11:22 AM
So I can't take my leaky ex. manifold any more, It sounds so shitty! Since the back half of the exhaust was already replaced with new plumbing and sport muffler, I figured I'd like to make the front half match.

we all know st162s are hard to find parts for. can someone point me in the right direction?

Does a 5sfe header fit or come close to fitting at all?

Worst case scenario I'll make one, or just source a junkyard replacement. But the name of the game is "cheap" since I'll be scrapping it all when I start the turbo conversion.

grayscale
04-04-2009, 11:53 AM
Check the product review sticky here in NA. Crisco's 4th gen header review is there along with some others.
3sge right? 5s headers fit as far as the flange goes, but the tube design is what I think you have to watch for, something about the position of the starter on yours. You can always use a factory 3sge header from an '89 GTS, if you can find one. That's what I run on my 5s.

Grot
04-04-2009, 03:29 PM
finding one is the hard part.

RedRkt01
04-04-2009, 08:49 PM
All 4th Gen part searches inevitably end when :bowdown: RedRkt01 gets involved :bigthumbu .

Grot
04-04-2009, 10:52 PM
Can you get a stock GTS header?

usp45
04-05-2009, 08:49 AM
Check the product review sticky here in NA. Crisco's 4th gen header review is there along with some others.
3sge right? 5s headers fit as far as the flange goes, but the tube design is what I think you have to watch for, something about the position of the starter on yours. You can always use a factory 3sge header from an '89 GTS, if you can find one. That's what I run on my 5s.

thanks that helps. I don't think it would be too hard to modify a cheapo 5s header. I need to build a cat delete section anyways, so its not much more work.

RedRkt01
04-05-2009, 02:02 PM
5S GTS or 3S GTS? At least in the Celica they are both cast types.....which begs the question of whether there is flow freed up by switching from one to the other. At first glance I'd say no.

I'm not certain if I can score the stockers.....only almost postitive.

grayscale
04-05-2009, 04:11 PM
No, this-

http://www.celicatech.com/gallery/files/5/3/3/2/3sge3.jpg

RedRkt01
04-05-2009, 07:03 PM
Cannon....what's the P/N on that? Is that out of a Camry? I don't know why that would make a difference....but I could've sworn that the 5th Gen GTS had a cast manifold; The EPC I referenced depicted one when I double checked yesterday, confirming my thoughts.

CriScO
04-05-2009, 07:21 PM
Check the location of your starter, BTW. Most fourth gen GT-S' will have it in a very bad place. Any 3S/5S header will fit, but if your starter's too close it'll keep frying the solenoid.

Edit: Didn't notice that Cannon mentioned that. :)

grayscale
04-06-2009, 01:00 AM
Cannon....what's the P/N on that? Is that out of a Camry? I don't know why that would make a difference....but I could've sworn that the 5th Gen GTS had a cast manifold; The EPC I referenced depicted one when I double checked yesterday, confirming my thoughts.
No no no. That is a 3sge manifold. It only came here one year, in the '89 GTS. However all other cars outside of the US(not sure about Can) that got a 3sge got this manifold, i.e. all 3sge 5th gens in the UK have it. Wish I new a pn# but I don't. I still see a lot of UK ebay sellers selling them, cheap too, but it's a real pain to get one to ship it over here. If you do find one, let me know, I still want to get ahold of the stock secondary.

Grot
04-06-2009, 01:01 AM
me wants one too

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:03 AM
I gotta say that I have never seen that on an '89 GTS. Part wants of me to trust you.....the other part thinks you gotta screw loose.....

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:06 AM
I can get it......I would like a P/N if you can find it on there somewhere.

grayscale
04-06-2009, 01:11 AM
I have one confirmation, and that is Ciento44 ran across one in a junkyard in Indy last year.
No pn# on the darn thing anywhere though, I've looked in the past.
Here's two in the UK ebay-
One (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=270369040652)
Two (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=130298181828)

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:18 AM
I know they came on the ST182 and 202....my 3SGE is sporting one right now (only until the HKS unit gets here ;) )

I just don't quite believe that they were used on just the '89 GTS. Especially since the primary cat was mounted to the cast manifold. Eliminating that cat would only leave the secondary; That wouldn't fly in CA. I'd be willing to bet that Ben pulled that from a car that was owned by someone who knew what they were doing.....meaning it wasn't original.

Grot
04-06-2009, 01:21 AM
Either way, can you get ahold of one?

grayscale
04-06-2009, 01:22 AM
I know they came on the ST182 and 202....my 3SGE is sporting one right now (only until the HKS unit gets here ;) )

I just don't quite believe that they were used on just the '89 GTS. Especially since the primary cat was mounted to the cast manifold. Eliminating that cat would only leave the secondary; That wouldn't fly in CA. I'd be willing to bet that Ben pulled that from a car that was owned by someone who knew what they were doing.....meaning it wasn't original.
Ben never pulled it. :wtf:
Anyhoo, it was all stock. I've seen similar on Corollas of the same years, I don't what engines those were though. There's an '89 GTS Corolla in a yard near me with one.
I bought mine from a guy here in the US that was parting out an '89 GTS on ebay about 2-3 years ago.

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:29 AM
I'm having a really hard time digesting that. Every EPC I've seen shows that regular manifold. That and it doesn't make sense. By the summer of '88 the 5th Gen was well under way in development and something as important as the powerplant would surely have been decided upon; That said, why would they choose to put a different manifold, effectively limiting where they can sell it (don't forget the % of sales CA brings to the picture), on an engine that they would had to have known they were not going to release into the US on the next model? Also, power output would've increased due to a little more flow; Why is it still rated 135 HP in '89 like the other years?

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:31 AM
Grot, how much you wanna pay? I can get these all day long from some buddies of mine in Australia. I also have some friends in the UK that can help out, but they are harder to get ahold of there.

Price to be paid is pretty much the determinant. Hell, I can't get 4th Gen tail inserts or front corners to sell after I tack on my shipping cost....and those weigh nothing.

grayscale
04-06-2009, 01:32 AM
Wish I could answer those for you, but here's another one to add to the list- why was the 3sge only offered in the 4thgens in the US and not the next two gens?

Grot
04-06-2009, 01:32 AM
You got PM.

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:37 AM
I bet it had something to do with the change of philosophy at the top. It's my opinion that the '95 MR2, '98 Supra, and '05 Celica deaths as well as the delay of the 7th Gen to 2000 were all born in the late 80's........I would say that they knew their approach was changing and the sports market no longer meant much to them; Hence no 3SGE.....they didn't need it because sales were going to be driven by fuel efficient F heads and reliable Camrys and Corollas.

grayscale
04-06-2009, 01:39 AM
So why did they bother selling them to everyone else?

RedRkt01
04-06-2009, 01:43 AM
Different markets = different strategies. TO be #1 in the world means conquering the US market. Sports are different in Europe and Japan. They both have mass transit so having a car is a luxury unlike the necessity it has become here. That's why they have it there.

Here Toyota needed to gobble up market share by appealing to people with reliability and economy. Ever ask yourself why the Camry was the best selling car for over 10 years?

usp45
04-08-2009, 10:59 AM
any body know how the mr2 5sfe header is routed through the engine bay? I came to the conclusion that the celica 5sfe header requires to much modification to put on a 4g gts... without relocating the starter... which may be what I do.

RedRkt01
04-08-2009, 01:54 PM
FYI peeps......I have two people scouring the yards for st182 and st202 headers.

grayscale
04-08-2009, 03:51 PM
any body know how the mr2 5sfe header is routed through the engine bay? I came to the conclusion that the celica 5sfe header requires to much modification to put on a 4g gts... without relocating the starter... which may be what I do.
The header is pretty much the same, it's the secondary that's different. I assume you have the starter mounted on the engine block and not the transmission?