PDA

View Full Version : "Competing" models of cars is sometimes rediculous



Ghosty
04-03-2008, 01:51 AM
Just came across this (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/31/the-word-from-on-high-no-audi-r4-for-you/) March 31st article that said Audi canned the mid-engined R4 because it would compete too intensely with the Porsche Boxter.

Then, I came across this (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/31/autoline-on-autoblog-with-john-mcelroy/) opinion blog about Dodge canning the viper, because Chrysler now wants Dodge to produce only trucks, for Chrysler to only produce cars, and for Jeep to be just... well... Jeeps.

Personally, I think automakers are doing themselves a disservice when pulling this type of crap.

First and foremost, automakers are supposed to make cars that sell. Why should Porsche/ Audi care if the R4 takes away from the Boxter? If they can sell more R4s and increase the profit margin, then by God, that's what they should do! To hell with the Boxter if it can't sell as much. And who's to say people won't buy a damned Boxter anyway, if that's what they want?

And this nonsense about Dodge being just trucks and Chrysler being just cars... that's just going to hurt images. Dodge is performance, Chrysler is luxury. Could a viper be re-badged Chrysler? Sure, but you'd have to do more to it to make it a "real" Chrysler... like put a big baby-Bently chrome grill on it. Seat warmers. Big honkin' chrome rims. Room for four. Whatever.

Another thing -- what about the Dodge Charger? The long-since-gone SRT-4? Those aren't Chrysler customers, they're Dodge customers. If they wanted a Chrysler, they'd have bought a 300 or Sebring. They are alienating a lot of people and losing a lot of customers.

Did none of these people go to business school? Did they just pull degrees out of their asses or something?

tuner4life
04-03-2008, 04:24 AM
Why do you think Daimler dumped Chrysler out on their ass, It's because Daimler realized that they were not being benefited in any way, and were actually loosing $.

car
04-03-2008, 04:31 AM
I don't see Dodge ever getting rid of the Viper, and definately not the new Challenger, that thing is teh sex

Cavanagh
04-03-2008, 04:32 AM
Boxsters are Girl cars anywho....
Chrysler makes alot of foolish mistakes. I dont know how long they're going to last honestly.

grayscale
04-03-2008, 10:43 AM
Then, I came across this (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/31/autoline-on-autoblog-with-john-mcelroy/) opinion blog about Dodge canning the viper, because Chrysler now wants Dodge to produce only trucks, for Chrysler to only produce cars, and for Jeep to be just... well... Jeeps.
That's a load of crap. Sounds like some one with diarrhea of the mouth to me. There is way too much invested with the Charger, Challenger, Magnum, SRT4, etc, for them to just up and say "ok guys, no more cars".

midship
04-03-2008, 03:46 PM
American car companies are in rough waters right now.

Another thing -- what about the Dodge Charger? The long-since-gone SRT-4? Those aren't Chrysler customers, they're Dodge customers. If they wanted a Chrysler, they'd have bought a 300 or Sebring. They are alienating a lot of people and losing a lot of customers.
You answered much of your question right there.
They tried to make the cars that customers are buying; A Sedan with lots of power and a hot import-esque sports car.
But, sales aren't increasing.
All that is left is to change up the branding if they can't design a car that can be sold.

There is way too much invested with the Charger, Challenger, Magnum, SRT4, etc, for them to just up and say "ok guys, no more cars".
Better to bail out now, rather than once they've lost all of their investment.
None of those cars are exactly selling like hotcakes. And they sure did dump that srt-4 real quick.

I, for one, would never buy a mopar anyway. And I know a lot of people that share the same opinion.

midship
04-03-2008, 04:12 PM
Oh and on the Porsche/Audi thing.
The market for little two-seat mid-engine sports cars is incredibly small.
It would be dumb as hell for them to compete against themselves in a market which they already have cornered with the boxter.
That's common business sense.

First and foremost, automakers are supposed to make cars that sell. Why should Porsche/ Audi care if the R4 takes away from the Boxter? If they can sell more R4s and increase the profit margin, then by God, that's what they should do! To hell with the Boxter if it can't sell as much. And who's to say people won't buy a damned Boxter anyway, if that's what they want?
There would be no way to increase profit margin by adding another car to the mix.
They would increase fixed and marginal costs by a ton by producing another car, making it harder to reach economies of scale.
Since you would also probably lose some of the boxter sales, marginal cost of producing the boxter would go up too.

ciento44
04-03-2008, 04:19 PM
I don't see Dodge ever getting rid of the Viper, and definately not the new Challenger, that thing is teh sex



Viper is already gone, buddy.

StormyBklyn
04-03-2008, 04:26 PM
Viper is already gone, buddy.

The Viper is gone?!?!? Oh, no!
A Dodge that goes 200mph? Why would anyone see any problems with that.


(By the way, that was 100% sarcasm)

VikingJZ
04-03-2008, 04:35 PM
Yeah thats too bad about the Viper. I always loved that car. It was really the only competition for the Corvette in America from a domestic company until the GTR.


Challenger won't go by the wayside I would suspect any time soon. Its going to be one of those cars with a turbo four or six in ten years with the CAFE standards. Unless they can get the 5.7 or its successor to reach 35 MPG or better, the muscle car era will last about as long as the first one did.

In thirty years expect the Dodge Charger range, Magnum, and 300C ranges to be rare and highly sought after like in the 70's, especially the SRT-8 models.

Challenger will be no different.

VikingJZ
04-03-2008, 04:38 PM
And the Vette would probably be cancelled over sticking a V6 or similar engine in. Likewise, it may be cancelled after that because of Vette fans in outrage.

Who knows, we may be able to hit the CAFE standards and have our toys too.


Kind of like having your cake and eating it too or whatever.

StormyBklyn
04-03-2008, 05:16 PM
Yeah thats too bad about the Viper. I always loved that car. It was really the only competition for the Corvette in America from a domestic company until the GTR.


I was really kidding about the Viper. I just don't trust a Dodge that can break 200 mph. I used to love the Viper also, until I was in one and saw how it handled. I don't know if they made any improvements, but I rode in a '95, and the thing handled like a garbage truck. A garbage truck with a flat tire. I always did like the styling of a Viper over a Corvette, but I would feel safer in a Corvette.
I still think both cars are made for middle aged men going through mid life crises and feelings on inadequacies.
But what do I know, I'd still take my little four bangers over either of them any day.

91GTvert
04-03-2008, 05:39 PM
One of the main reasons these companies are going to sh*ts is that they try out an idea for a few years and when they have issues they scrap it instead of revising designs and making minor adjustments. Think of how Toyota, or Subaru, or even GM and Nissan have used basically the same engines and drive train parts across half or more of their vehicles and use the same platforms with minor tweaks for 10, 20, 30 or more years. Having the same motors in our Celicas as well as camrys, MR2s, corollas, 4 runners, and hell....trucks...this makes parts and service easier to come across and cheaper, even for these cars as they get older. Now if only Chrysler, VW, Ford, ect. could figure this out they could get much much further ahead in the game. But for now, they'll stick to scrapping ideas when they have issues.

cs363
04-03-2008, 07:39 PM
The Viper had the NVH properties of a truck, and i really liked the way the roof got sucked off the convertible when you went over 200Km/h......

car
04-04-2008, 03:11 AM
Viper is already gone, buddy.

I'm depressed now, I was, and still am in love with the ACR though...